Moode 7.01 does not start on newest RPi 4 8GB RAM

[Convert]

Hi everybody, why this technical question in the Sound Quality section?

I use Moode 7.01 due to its sound quality which I find has deteriorated since with every new version of Moode afterwards. Something that happend to Volumio, too, before I made the switch to Moode a couple of years ago.

Now my RPI 3+ died, I bought a new RPi 4 8GB but Moode 7.01 does not start with error code

4 long    4 short green LED flashes    Unsupported board type


The newest Moode starts on this new RPI

1.  I think this is a kernel issue, the 7.01 kernel does not work with the new board.
   Any chance to upgrade the kernel to run 7.01?
   
   
2. Why is the SQ deteriorating and is there a chance Tim Curtis could release a Moode-Lite with just basic functions but big focus on SQ?
   

Thanks in advance

Chris

[marcinmarcin]

Hi, thought the same. Then installed 761 on one card, 830 64b on second, to quickly change. Both play great with mconnect by upnp, maybe even 830 is better. Try new version, remember about installing with user, ssh etc in raspberry imager.

[Nutul]

[*] I think this is a kernel issue, the 7.01 kernel does not work with the new board.
Any chance to upgrade the kernel to run 7.01?

you probably mean having the 8.3.3 running on the kernel that shipped with the 7.0.1. It could be done, provided the 8.3.3 doesn't rely on something that's available on the newer kernels only.

[*]Why is the SQ deteriorating and is there a chance Tim Curtis could release a Moode-Lite with just basic functions but big focus on SQ?

I may be wrong, but there is no such thing as "moode light". Moode can use just the bare basic: ALSA + MPD (and the relevant drivers in the kernel, when it's the case).

[Convert]

[*]
you probably mean having the 8.3.3 running on the kernel that shipped with the 7.0.1. It could be done, provided the 8.3.3 doesn't rely on something that's available on the newer kernels only.



[*]I may be wrong, but there is no such thing as "moode light". Moode can use just the bare basic: ALSA + MPD (and the relevant drivers in the kernel, when it's the case).

[*]
I was more thinking using 7.0.1 with a newer kernel so it would run on the newer RPI 4 board.
[*]
With Moode lite I mean MDP, web-interface and perhaps Sox.
[*]
I saw this with Volumio, the more feature rich it became the worse the sound got. I realized this when I had guests over for a session running back then the newest Volumio. My SD-card died suddenly, I pulled one with an older Volumio on it out of the drawer and was really surprised about the full sound, not veiled at all like the newer versions.
[*]
Now with Moode I see the same happening....
[*]
Chris

[Tim Curtis]

Very odd. I'm not having any sound quality issues whatsoever on any of my systems with the latest release of moOde.

Given the wide differences in peoples perception of sound quality coupled with all the inherent biases and expectations in the mind and differences in hearing range it's hard to justify changing anything in moOde just based on someone else's "ears".

If on the other hand there is evidence of a defect in the code, or a trace of audio data within the software pipeline that showed unwanted distortion being added, or audible glitches or distortions that can be reproduced and confirmed by others then there is something that could possibly be investigated.

[Nutul]

I have been listening to my music through moOde for the second year in a row, approximately for 3 to 6 hours a day. Every day.
Been using 2 different DACs:

1. Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 (actually a musician's audio interface, but I just used it as a DAC)
2. Eversolo Z8 DAC

Despite the differences between the two (which became evident, of course, only once I had the possibility to hear the second one...) which are irrelevant to describe here, I have experienced no sound degradation during such time.

Now, some ears are made better than others, but I know very well almost all of my music library, since the time I used to listen to it with a SONY CD player, a class A amp (made in the USA, but cannot remember the brand...) and two danish hi-end 2-way speakers.

Today all that is gone (ehm... I switched Country, and my brother prowled everything I couldn't easily bring over... blame it on me), as I now have a RPi4 + the above DAC + active studio monitors. Well, the quality is not only improved (as expected) but again, has never degraded to day, despite several moOde updates.

One thing I must admit:
both my DACs do not need any driver, they just implement the USB audio 2.0 protocol which is native in the Linux kernel... Now, I know this restricts moOde from being able to fully control them, but maybe also keeps anything (harmful to SQ?) from being pulled into the audio chain...

Just my 2c on the matter

[Convert]

Thanks to Nutul, Marciarcin and Tim,

I know it is difficult to quantify, but Edwards tweaks in the past showed that changing or switching on certain parameters and processes can alter the sound.

My take on it is that due to more and more features more and more processes are started and maintained which could explain the change in SQ. Hence the idea of a basic Moode running are barebone musicserver serving just the DAC, perhaps SOX up-/downsampling in the mix, web interface....

I know this is very subjective subject, relying on so many different components like the individual, the sound system, even the type of RPI...

I will be not surprised if this topic goes nowhere. Just wanted to share my experience.

[Nutul]

@Tim Curtis

out of curiosity, what might be the overall increase of "things" running in the background in the past two / three years or so, which could result in an increased system load?

[TheOldPresbyope]

What you ask for is summarized in the release notes and available in excruciating detail in the git history.

[Nutul]

What you ask for is summarized in the release notes and available in excruciating detail in the git history.

Hi Kent,

I am pretty sure there wasn't a more polite way to remind me how lazy I am... :-D