Pi 64-bit kernel

[philrandal]

Hi folks,

I'm currently testing Moode with the Pi 64-bit kernel 

It's too early for my cloth-ears to tell if there's any audible difference, but here's the steps required to test it yourself.

You'll need a Pi 3B or later with 64-bit processor (BCM2837 or later).

First update the kernel

Code:

sudo PRUNE_MODULES=1 rpi-update

then shutdown Moode and edit /boot/config.txt adding the line

Code:

arm_64bit=1

Then reboot moode, and if all goes well,

pi@moode:~ $ uname -a

Linux moode 4.19.73-v8+ #1267 SMP PREEMPT Fri Sep 20 18:14:38 BST 2019 aarch64 GNU/Linux

Note the "v8+" and "aarch64".

It's all working fine on my system so far.

Enjoy!

Cheers,

Phil

[TheOldPresbyope]

Hi, Phil.

I guess I missed the lecture. Other than the pure intellectual fun of it, what's the point of this exercise?

Regards,
Kent

[philrandal]

Hi, Phil.

I guess I missed the lecture. Other than the pure intellectual fun of it, what's the point of this exercise?

Regards,
Kent

To see if it makes a difference.  And why not?  I did find a discussion the other day about likely improvements with a 64-bit kernel compiled for ARM v8, but can't find it now.

It was just so easy to do I couldn't resist!

I was hoping the magical-ears folk on here would chime in and say how extra-wonderful (or not) moode sounds with the 64-bit kernel.

Phil

[TheOldPresbyope]

I found a quote on gearslutz that perfectly encapsulates my thinking on this:

"I do prefer the vintage sound of 32-bit...."

[Tim Curtis]

lol

It works on my 3A+ but I can't tell the diff between 64 and 32 as far as moOde performance goes. The Pi engineer that's handling the 64 bit kernel considers it to be experimental at this point so I think I'll stick with 32 bit for moOde releases until it becomes stable.

[JonPike]

lol

It works on my 3A+ but I can't tell the diff between 64 and 32 as far as moOde performance goes. The Pi engineer that's handling the 64 bit kernel considers it to be experimental at this point so I think I'll stick with 32 bit for moOde releases until it becomes stable.

Yeah,  that was going to be my question...  would it be more efficient in some way?  But, on the higher end Pi's,  even doing a lot of numerically intensive stuff like resampling, crossfeeding, EQ'ing,  its hard to really load them down running Moode.  On the lower end ones where you might,  I'm not clear there is a 64b kernel you can run...

[TheOldPresbyope]

It's necessary to do a good deal of homework to understand whether a 64-bit OS will benefit a particular application. 

Even a little browsing will show there's so many if's, and's, and but's that there isn't any easy-to-digest, one-size-fits-all answer. I could go on at length but I won't (hint, I used to do heavy-duty scientific computations in my professional life, where we were squeezing the life out of the computers and their compilers).

Obviously I'm very dubious that it offers any practical advantage with our audio playback even assuming moOde and all its libraries and supporting functions were recompiled to be 64-bit rather than 32-bit binaries.

But FOSS gives everybody the freedom to try it for themselves. Bottom line: does it help you enjoy the music?


Regards,
Kent

[philrandal]

It's necessary to do a good deal of homework to understand whether a 64-bit OS will benefit a particular application. 

Even a little browsing will show there's so many if's, and's, and but's that there isn't any easy-to-digest, one-size-fits-all answer. I could go on at length but I won't (hint, I used to do heavy-duty scientific computations in my professional life, where we were squeezing the life out of the computers and their compilers).

Obviously I'm very dubious that it offers any practical advantage with our audio playback even assuming moOde and all its libraries and supporting functions were recompiled to be 64-bit rather than 32-bit binaries.

But FOSS gives everybody the freedom to try it for themselves. Bottom line: does it help you enjoy the music?


Regards,
Kent

sox resampling and mpd could benefit from 64-bit code, and on the UI front, so could php.  Userland 64-bit stuff is some way off, though.

Still awaiting people's A/B listening tests  

Phil

[ghulamr]

OP - I am new to Moode Audio and so far it's been a very high grade audiophile experience. Have tried VitOS, RopieeXL, DietPi and I am pretty certain Moode is the best sounding to my ear and my system. 

I also did A/B between the 32bit and 64 bit kernel architecture. I am not a Linux coder or anyone who really understands the inner dynamics of CPU design, but once again with the 64 bit setting there was clear instrument separation, more pronounced black background, cleaner lows and better vocals without any digital glare or fatigue.  

I wanted to take the time to write my opinion in case someone can benefit. I am very impressed with Moode. 

Office setup:
Croft Integrated amp
Metrum Onyx DAC
Harbeth p3esr speakers 
Roon endpoint - Raspberry Pi4 running Moode USB into my DAC (waiting for Pi2AES HAT)

Listening Roon:
Sim Audio amplifier 
Metrum Jade preamp/DAC
Aurender Streamer
Von Schweikerts 
JL Audio fathom sub (2)

[the_bertrum]

I was hoping the magical-ears folk on here would chime in and say how extra-wonderful (or not) moode sounds with the 64-bit kernel.

My Magical ears tell me that 32 bit sounds better because the 64bit often causes odd things to stop working such as library scans and so on. This results in a sonic artifact that I call "no music" and audio theory clearly states that "no music" is always worse than "some music".